Choosing between Inland and Outland Spousal Sponsorship

[JHN]

Hello,

I am a Canadian Citizen and I'm having a super difficult time figuring out all my options, mainly because the situation is complicated. I currently live and work in South Korea with my Wife to be BUT she is not Korean.


My Fiance is from Kazakhstan and I'm from Canada but we are both living and working in South Korea. The difficult part is figuring out whether we can and should do the

a) Outland Process from South Korea (Which is looking to be difficult because we don't have a marriage certificate yet and its apparently not possible for 2 foreigners to get an 'official' marriage certificate in South Korea, ONLY a marriage registration. This apparently is different and I believe will not be accepted by the Canadian Government for the Spousal Sponsorship) OR

b) Inland Process by trying to get her a visitor/work visa of some sort and then get all the paperwork and marriage certificates here while we are both in Canada. The issue here is that we are worried about getting a Visitor Visa/eTA for her and then applying would affect her chances (I believe if her intent is to marry me, she will be rejected for a visa). We would also like to avoid as much "non-working' time as possible. We would like to reduce the amount of "visiting' time and have her have the status to legally work in Canada ASAP.

Therefore, if anyone knows whats the best option for our case I would really appreciate some clarity, I've tried calling embassy and e-mail and it seems like our case is a bit complex. We are also thinking of possibly moving to Kazakhstan for a while to get all the marriage certifications and other things there and apply for an Outland Spousal Sponsorship there but not sure if that would be the best route.

Sorry for the long post, I will appreciate all advise and information everyone could provide, thank you so much!

 

[Riley Haas]

You should contact the Canadian Embassy is Seoul to see if they will accept the Marriage Registration.

You are correct that if the only reason she is coming to Canada is to marry you, she would be rejected. But she's married to you already, isn't she? Also, if the only reason to come is to get sponsored, she would be rejected. However, if she gets in, she can apply for a work permit when yous sponsor her.

What does she do for a living? Can she immigrate some other way?

 

[JHN]

You should contact the Canadian Embassy is Seoul to see if they will accept the Marriage Registration.

You are correct that if the only reason she is coming to Canada is to marry you, she would be rejected. But she's married to you already, isn't she? Also, if the only reason to come is to get sponsored, she would be rejected. However, if she gets in, she can apply for a work permit when yous sponsor her.

What does she do for a living? Can she immigrate some other way?

We are not legally married or registered in any capacity at the moment because we don't really know what our best option in terms of documents are. We want to but cant figure if all out :'(

Thank you for replying! I already contacted the Canadian Embassy here in Seoul and they said they cannot help. They said that we can both get the document which allows us to legally be registered as married but this is not an official "marriage certificate". We can also apparently get a letter of confirmation which is sometimes used as a replacement for a marriage certificate.

The issue here is will the Manila office for Canadian Embassy accept these 2 docs (registration and letter) as a full and legal replacement of a marriage certificate needed for the Outland Spousal Sponsorship Package. I tried calling and emailing to confirm, waiting for a reply.

She might be able to get a visitor visa and work permit but again this might be looking hard and we have good jobs abroad. But we are willing to sacrifice in order to be together

 

[John Immanuel]

LOVELY!! I wish you all the best.

 

[JHN]

We are not legally married or registered in any capacity at the moment because we don't really know what our best option in terms of documents are. We want to but cant figure if all out :'(

Thank you for replying! I already contacted the Canadian Embassy here in Seoul and they said they cannot help. They said that we can both get the document which allows us to legally be registered as married but this is not an official "marriage certificate". We can also apparently get a letter of confirmation which is sometimes used as a replacement for a marriage certificate.

The issue here is will the Manila office for Canadian Embassy accept these 2 docs (registration and letter) as a full and legal replacement of a marriage certificate needed for the Outland Spousal Sponsorship Package. I tried calling and emailing to confirm, waiting for a reply.

She might be able to get a visitor visa and work permit but again this might be looking hard and we have good jobs abroad. But we are willing to sacrifice in order to be together

If anyone know what to do in this situation please let us know. Its been straining to figure all this out without anyone to directly to contact and speak to. Apparently the only form to communicate is strictly Email.

 

[Riley Haas]

Yes, email is usually the only form of communication allowed.

Have you thought about traveling to another country where the two of you can marry and get a proper marriage certificate?

 

[JHN]

I see, I wouldnt have expected that. Because I guess our case is a bit weird maybe.

Yes, we are looking at options to go to a country with a Canadian Visa Application Centre that deals with Outland Sponsorship Services (Manila or Moscow) or try to apply from Kazakhstan and live there for a bit. Trying to see if these are viable options and trying as best as possible to not be physically apart and at least make some money while we wait during the process.

This seems hard because I would be able to make more money back in Canada of course or even Korea. So trying to see if I can get a Job in Kazakhstan while we go through the process + my fiance working in her home country, Kazakhstan (seems like the best option for making money while staying together).

Thanks again for replying, I really appreciate talking to a real person about this and not stressing by myself.

 

[Riley Haas]

Well, if you can someone get her a job in Canada, or she can get a visitor visa to Canada, then that would be the best option.

But if she can't, even just eloping to Japan or something might be better. She could return to work in Korea while the application is being processed. You would be apart though.

(If I haven't mentioned this before: you really should be in Canada during the outland sponsorship process.)

 

[JHN]

Well, if you can someone get her a job in Canada, or she can get a visitor visa to Canada, then that would be the best option.

But if she can't, even just eloping to Japan or something might be better. She could return to work in Korea while the application is being processed. You would be apart though.

(If I haven't mentioned this before: you really should be in Canada during the outland sponsorship process.)

You are able to be in Canada and apply as an "outland sponsorship process"? My understanding is that your residence had to be outside of Canada during this process no? Also during this outland process would it be possible to get a travel visa for my fiance? I will call the Canadian Embassy and try to look online but if anyone knows that would be awesome!

 

[Riley Haas]

"Inland" and "outland" refer to the location of the sponsored spouse/partner, not the location of the sponsor.

If the sponsor is outside of Canada there is a further burden of proof to demonstrate that you will immigrate to Canada. To the best of our knowledge, these types of applications are rarely, if ever, approved.

Once you have sponsored your spouse outland it is highly unlikely she'll be approved for a visitor visa because they assume that the reason she would be coming is to stay with you during the sponsorship process.

 

[JHN]

"Inland" and "outland" refer to the location of the sponsored spouse/partner, not the location of the sponsor.

If the sponsor is outside of Canada there is a further burden of proof to demonstrate that you will immigrate to Canada. To the best of our knowledge, these types of applications are rarely, if ever, approved.

Once you have sponsored your spouse outland it is highly unlikely she'll be approved for a visitor visa because they assume that the reason she would be coming is to stay with you during the sponsorship process.

Would it make sense to get married in Kazakhstan (Her Home Country), get their official marriage certificate and register it in Canada. Then get her a visitor visa (TRV) under the reason of her visiting as my spouse and then doing the inland spousal sponsorship.

The main reason why I am asking is because it has been hard to figure out how to get her a travel visa. some of the requirements would be hard to overcome so I am thinking if we are already married outside of Canada legally and have the paperwork. Then it shouldn't be a problem to get her a travel visa into Canada and then sponsor her is it?

 

[Riley Haas]

Yes, you could get married in Kazakhstan and, if she can get a visitor visa to Canada, sponsor her inland. You don't have to "register" the marriage in Canada but you will have to get the marriage certificate translated into English or French and have the translation notarized.

IRCC is very reluctant to give visitor visas to those they think are coming here to stay permanently. It's basically against the rules. Visitors are not supposed to stay.

There's a tricky line to walk called "dual intent", which is the idea that the person is coming to visit and intends to leave in due course, unless of course they get permanent status in the meantime and then they stay. I have no idea how you comply with that, but that's the way it's assessed.

 

[JHN]

Yes, you could get married in Kazakhstan and, if she can get a visitor visa to Canada, sponsor her inland. You don't have to "register" the marriage in Canada but you will have to get the marriage certificate translated into English or French and have the translation notarized.

IRCC is very reluctant to give visitor visas to those they think are coming here to stay permanently. It's basically against the rules. Visitors are not supposed to stay.

There's a tricky line to walk called "dual intent", which is the idea that the person is coming to visit and intends to leave in due course, unless of course they get permanent status in the meantime and then they stay. I have no idea how you comply with that, but that's the way it's assessed.

Seems inconvenient that there is no way for us to be together during the 12 month process
We wanted to try outland but from what you said above
A) us being outside of Canada together and applying from Sponsorship looks like it would be rejected (because I guess I have to be in Canada to show we intent to move back)

B) Getting a visitor visa and then trying inland also seems like we have dual intent. I guess I will speak with a immigration lawyer to try to understand what are our choices.

C) I tried searching other visas but they don't seem to apply to our situation.

If she does come as a visitor and then we sponsor inland would our sponsor application be rejected because we had "dual" intent for her visitor visa?

It seems counterintuitive that my fiance wouldnt even be able to experience Canada before moving there permanently

Thank you again for responding, Ive been having a difficult time trying to figure all the logistics out

 

[Riley Haas]

A) Yes, you should not apply when you personally are outside of Canada.

B) She can apply for a visitor visa now or at any time in the future and you do not have to be in Canada yet for her to apply. Whether or not it's approved depends upon her stated reasons for coming, the invitation letter (which you would write for her) and whether or not they believe she is returning back to South Korea or Kazakhstan. "Dual intent" only comes in if she is actually travelling to Canada to marry you or visit you and get sponsored. Stating that in the visa application would likely result in a refusal. It's more for the port of entry, than anything.

C) There aren't other forms of visitor visas. There's just the one. There are also work permits and study permits.

I think you should probably talk to a lawyer or a consultant. I appear to make things more confusing for you every time I respond. It's not as complicated as you think. There are basically 2 choices:

1. You and she travel to Canada (she has a visitor visa) and you sponsor her inland OR
2. You travel to Canada and you sponsor her outland.

You should definitely be married for situation 2 but don't have to be in situation 1 until you want to submit the sponsorship application.

 

[JHN]

Sorry if I seem to be confused I think the main issue with both of the options given are that

1) Visitor Visa might Not be possible. I have to look at the specifics. Thank you again for helping me a lot sorry for all the questions

2) travelling to canada and sponsoring outland means we have to physically apart.

Our main to 2 goals and to be together physically and still gain a decent income to save for our future (work in korea, kazakhstan or canada together physically during the application processs) but it seems like its not possible

I will call a lawyer this weekeend to discuss the details but thank you so much. If you have more advice I would love to hear it

 

[Riley Haas]

Here's the thing about the visitor visa: to know it's impossible she has to apply and then get refused. If she is approved, there is no problem.